First try SnF

[mikecon]

I would call it bleeding the corner. Not too bad. Just enough to cost him power. A typical step taken by barrel turners. First they learn the concept of turning the barrel....but they do it out front. Then they learn to get it behind the corner and stay behind the corner and.....WOW.

Keep working. He's getting more and more comfortable with each clip you post.

OK, thank you very much, Teach. I understand where we need to focus. Have a great weekend.

[mikecon]

No time for one-on-one practice since last post. Some more video evidence in the meanwhile...


Friday night game. High and tight pitch off the handle. Looks like it went straight up but actually got well out to left field and hooked out of play. Bad pitch selection but I like the aggressiveness. I don't know that there's anything new here (not coming from behind the corner)...

Same AB, after taking a strike, a ball, and fouling above, pretty good 2-strike hitting; good depth and well-struck single to right on the down-and-away pitch...

Here's something from yesterday team practice/intra-squad scrimmage that I've seen too much of; missing the fastball fouling it back or up. Anything additional of mechanical note here?...

[Pronk]

This guy is going to come along well. Tightening things up will come and when it does kaaaboooom.

[mikecon]

This guy is going to come along well. Tightening things up will come and when it does kaaaboooom.

Trying to work things in a little at a time. Getting him to understand the 'why' behind each technique. Can't wait to post before and after like this, though ...

[mikecon]

A complete AB from this afternoon that ends with a base hit to left. I have to smile at the frustration he's dealing with up there -- I think he's getting comfortable with things to the point where he fully expects to be ripping everything. I think that's also why he's being overaggressive in his pitch selection. But I'm OK with that right now.

Anything new to be seen here? Still not turning it behind the corner, yes?

Weather permitting, tourney with travel team this weekend should provide some more game looks against quality pitching.

Thanks in advance for ongoing guidance!


P.S. Note #16 on deck, who goes to the same instructor Matt previously worked with, diligently working on his "extension". Ugh.

[Pronk]

For me I know this probably goes against how Teach views it, but when I am looking at a swing, I feel the corner being the back shoulder (thanks to a solid scip) is already getting turned forward at the very time the hands start to turn the barrel.

That of course is not a teaching point just a visual that helps me.

From the sequence here, the leg should start to turn first right?
If the SCIP is tight, the hand pivot point occurs right at the same time as the hip is starting to turn.
Visually the shoulder is getting through then. but you can't teach that because they'll want to spin the front shoulder.

So really what you have is there there is an element of the uptick as the hips start to drop/head lowers which turns a leg because of the fight in the rear hip socket.
At this moment in time the hands are not traveling forward. See Mini-stealth swings.
Your son's hands are beginning forward before the leg has won thus to me no corner.

Remember that most of us here, the kids had success just learning to turn to the barrel, so don't sweat it too much yet. My younger son still can't find a consistent corner. We will.

A good gif of what I mean.

[Teacherman]

I have no problem with Pronk's shoulder explanation. As long as you understand the rear shoulder IS TURNED by something else....it is a good visual checkpoint. If you remember my 'segments' video....using the portion cups....that would apply here. It is still pulling back as the fused torso gets turned by the leg.

The 'wave' of pull backs....the sequence of pull backs....means....at the last or nearly last link....the shoulder will be turned forward just before uptick.

And his analysis of your son is good.

I also would suggest he lay off that high pitch while being aggressive. IMO, adjusting up is much harder than adjusting down or in and out. Focus on a pitch height that you will go below....but not above.

[mikecon]

...Your son's hands are beginning forward before the leg has won thus to me no corner...

Yes, I am with you 100%. I see it the same way.

...Remember that most of us here, the kids had success just learning to turn to the barrel, so don't sweat it too much yet.

The boy is not getting off that easy! Hell, we're only talking about a difference of 1 little video frame at 30fps!...

before: after:

(top half of frame 39 on frame 40 )

I have some things in mind that we will try to get this going. If/when we have success I will share what got us there.

...A good gif of what I mean...

I love that vid of Kent. A great hitter and giving great looks at what we once simply referred to as "separation"...



--

Thank you Pronk for your insight and feedback!

[mikecon]

I have no problem with Pronk's shoulder explanation. As long as you understand the rear shoulder IS TURNED by something else....it is a good visual checkpoint. If you remember my 'segments' video....using the portion cups....that would apply here. It is still pulling back as the fused torso gets turned by the leg.

The 'wave' of pull backs....the sequence of pull backs....means....at the last or nearly last link....the shoulder will be turned forward just before uptick.

And his analysis of your son is good.

Understood, Teach. Thank you!

I also would suggest he lay off that high pitch while being aggressive. IMO, adjusting up is much harder than adjusting down or in and out. Focus on a pitch height that you will go below....but not above.

There is no doubt about it. I only suggested I was "OK with that right now" because it told me he was confident in his swing mechanics. He is a great bunter and does exactly this ("Focus on a pitch height that you will go below") so I will remind him of that approach and that there is a top of the strike zone when swinging away, too.

[mikecon]

In looking again at this dry swing from a couple weeks ago...

...would you guys say there is a corner here? Legitimate separation?

I remember he had made a conscious effort here to let his lower go before his hands.

I ask because if you see this as 'directionally correct', I will have him recall and accentuate and repeat what he tried here. But if you think it's just a look then we'll be trying something different. Thanks in advance!

[Teacherman]

To answer your question, yes, there is a corner there.

A bit of an arm plunge....but for what you're asking....proceed with a yes.

[mikecon]

To answer you question, yes, there is a corner there.

A bit of an arm plunge....but for what you're asking....proceed with a yes.

Thank you, Teach

[mikecon]

A few random swings from tournament over the weekend...

Overall he was very productive:

PA_1B_2B_3B_HR_BB_HBP_SAC_FC_ROE_CI__R_RBI_SO_PS_L D_GB_FB__L__M__R_SB_CS_DP_PO__AB__H___BA__OBP__SLG ___OPS
16__4__2__1__0__3___0___0__1___0__0__6___9__2_48__ 5__5__1__4__4__3__2__0__0__0__13__7_.538_.625_.846 _1.471

And the team won the whole thing.

(Some of the 'non-traditional' stats that might not be evident: PS=Pitches Seen, LD=Line Drives, GB=Ground Balls, FB=Fly Balls, L=Left side, M=Middle, R=Right side)

While the results were pretty good, there is still work to be done. I know the sequence is still off; the corner is still bled or non-existent. Just putting these out there to see if you're seeing anything new or different. Thanks in advance!

Hooked down the left field line for 2B:

Swing and a miss at a curveball:

Liner to right center:

Lined past second baseman on a change:

Bounced out to first:

Swinging strike three:

[Pronk]

I have an idea of something you might want to try that helped us.

Around the time you see my before and after at some point in there we started to experiment with keeping the front leg in an externally rotated state during BP. That is at the top of the leg, just leave it slightly turned out throughout the swing.

I wanted them to feel ALL coil happening in the back leg. Not in the front leg internally rotating, which can lead to blocking the back leg getting through. I even coined the phrase jokingly on here calling the front heel being shown to the pitcher as RLWI or Rear Leg Winning Inhibitor. He's getting some good mileage here with learning to turn the barrel but I would love to see more LOAD AROUND meaning in the back leg.

[mikecon]

I have an idea of something you might want to try that helped us.

Around the time you see my before and after at some point in there we started to experiment with keeping the front leg in an externally rotated state during BP. That is at the top of the leg, just leave it slightly turned out throughout the swing.

I wanted them to feel ALL coil happening in the back leg. Not in the front leg internally rotating, which can lead to blocking the back leg getting through. I even coined the phrase jokingly on here calling the front heel being shown to the pitcher as RLWI or Rear Leg Winning Inhibitor. He's getting some good mileage here with learning to turn the barrel but I would love to see more LOAD AROUND meaning in the back leg.

Will most definitely try this.

(BTW, I was never a fan of "the front heel being shown to the pitcher". I don't know exactly when/how that worked its way in there -- as a Mets fan, too much watching David Wright, maybe. While I always saw that as 'extraneous' motion, I did not see it/realize it as "RLWI".)

Just two more games of middle school ball until that's over. Then, next week, we'll have after-school time back for working in the backyard again.

Pronk, your very relevant experience, guidance and interest is greatly appreciated!