LITHTHUNDER

[Teacherman]

I got your video off of bbd. You know, the place that has anti-troll.

Here is the one I downloaded....

LITHTHUNDER

I can see SOME benefit of SnF....however....your weight distrbution is such that you can't get where you need to get.

You do not get sufficiently 'around' your rear hip.

To get there several things must be right.

First....you have to have a weight distribution that is CENTERED OVER the ball of the rear femur. You are leaning back. You are almost to the 'take a shit in the woods' position that Power promotes. You will NEVER have success from that position. When you do what he suggests you can only load 'into' your rear hip....you can not get loaded 'around' your rear hip.



Bonds does not 'lean back' to load like Power does. That poor weight distribution PROHIBITS anything good from happening from that point forward.

Here is Powers drill and my SnF drill.....



Powers has assumed the 'take a shit in the woods' position. He is leaning back over behind the ball of his femur. His weight is off the back side of the ball of the femur. His weight is pushing 'into' his leg. His pelvis is coiled a bit but the weight is 'into' the side of the leg intead of 'around' the leg.

I am coiled 'around' the ball of my femur while keeping the weight 'centered' over the ball/leg. To do that my head is more 'out over the plate' like Bonds is. I am centered not just forward to back but also front to back and dugout to dugout. If my leg was choppled off I would fall straight down. If Powers leg was chopped off he would fall rearward.

Power's rear leg will NEVER pull the barrel from the position he gets into because he can not get 'AROUND' the hip. My rear leg MUST pull. It has to pull....because....I get coiled 'around' the hip socket without losing my weight. Not only does my hip socket get 'around' the ball of the femur, my lower back is pulling back 'around' more and my scap is pulling back 'around' more. What this creates is a spiral like load 'around' the leg. Power can not produce that. His leg is an 'into' the leg load. Yes, there is some coil in his hip. But not nearly enough. He can not get the barrel into 'the truth' position because of his hip/leg/weight alignment.

The proof of what is correct is in the Center of Gravity of the hitters. Watch Bonds cog go almost straight down....as he moves out. Power slides forward with little if any lowering. Watch his son do the same thing....



Any lowering that comes with what Power and his son are doing is simply you getting shorter because your legs are spreading as you move.

THe lowering that Bonds and Tex and others get is because of the pull backs, back and around their rear hip, that occur as they move out. You get a tightening....a stretching....and therefore a lowering as the leg fights the hip in the socket. Power has reached his range of motion limit in his socket....so has his son....but their range of motion is limited by their weight distribution....limited by their lean back. Bonds has no such lean back. He can get much furhter 'around' the ball of his femur. He can tighten the stretch in the socket much more....and as he moves out against that pulling back....his cog lowers.

Truth v nonsense.

Your current swing is very close to Cheyennes. Slightly better. He turns the barrel as he pushes the arms forward. He has to push the arms forward because his rear leg can not drive....drive like a transmission drives. It can't drive because he didn't get 'around'. He didn't get around because of his weight distrbiution and lean back. He gets some rearward barrel blur because of the barrel turning....but the power does not come from SnF around the leg.....it comes from his using two hips and two legs to create rotation.

No high level hitter rotates his hips. They do not use the muscles that rotate the hips to rotate the hips. They create the SnF load around the rear leg and then fire it. They fire it toward the ball. The very nature of the stretch being 'around' the ball of the femur will create a rotational unload 'around' the rear leg. And...when the lead leg strikes rotation is preserved....instead of falling linearly over the plate. BUT....the muscles that cause the hips to rotate were not used.

I like a lot of hitters....but for a visual of what the high level hitters are doing....I like Nelson Cruz. His actions show what they all do....



Watch him load 'around'....not back.

You should now be able to see that action in these guys....



Do any of these hitters take Powers 'shit in the woods'?

Even though their weight is back....they are one-legged with the weight being 'back' over the rear leg....they have a 'forward' look to them....forward as in leaning over the plate a bit and even toward the pitcher a bit.

That weight, while back, must be CENTERED OVER the leg.

You now have no excuse to listen to continue to listen to Power.

He couldn't be more wrong.

When you are ready to kick him to the curb, I will work with you.

But not until you kick him to the curb. I won't waste time with you while you experiment on multiple theories.

[Teacherman]

The sooner you understand this the sooner you will find the pattern....

Good hip/leg action:



Bad hip/leg action:



Your current action.....and Powers and his son and everyone influenced by him....have the bad 'into/outof' hip/leg action....instead of the 'around' hip/leg action.

You can't have good hip/leg action when you're taking a shit in the woods.

[LITHTHUNDER]

Rich, thanks for reaching out!! I am trying very hard to understand this and your explanation makes sense from what I'm seeing in the videos but I'm not sure I'm applying it correctly? I have corrected my posture and don't think I'm coiling into, but more "around". I seem to be getting the coil based off the test you mention, where the coil makes me unwind.

What is the "truth" position you mention?

I'm not sure I'm understanding the sequencing of what's happening.. If I look at mini-Stealth's swing sequence on this site (who has an amazing swing, nice job Stealth).
I see he is in a fairly neutral stance, he has a little crease in the backside - not sure if he's done a little coil around in his pre-setup. Not sure if he's pulling back at this point with his back/scap?
As his foot is lifting, he is loading his hands w/his tip and appears at the same time his coiling around and stepping/striding out
Is that close to what his sequence is?

What should be felt when it is done correctly?

Thanks,
Thunder

[Pronk]

Moving from my other thread, we'll centralize here.

One of the things we did years ago was to see if we could duplicate the lower body of Molitor since he doesn't have a lot going on. The idea being if our back leg can do what his does, then we can incorporate our own style.

That is an you get setup in such a way that the back leg wins instantly as soon as you move forward? Evidence of that is the body getting "sat" right. (see Molitor's head). Some might call that the hips dropping, the center of gravity lowering.

If you can duplicate Molitor, you'll start to feel it.

[Teacherman]

The Truth is a difficult thing to explain. It's difficult to 'see' until you 'feel' it.

But the bottom line is....it's a positioning of the hip/back/scap....AND barrel....in such a way that the leg/hip assembly PULLS the barrel around instead of pushing it.

In simple terms to pull something it must be behind the engine. If it is not you will push it.

Here are two clips to demonstrate the The Truth v NOT The Truth.



On the left, while under the influence of HI.com, Cheyenne had a better starting stance, he got loaded 'around' better, and he got the barrel up and behind his head in such a way that the rear leg/hip PULLS it around to contact.

On the right, Cheyenne had changed his stance and setup, he can no longer load 'around'.....he can only load 'into'.....his rear leg....so he can't get his barrel back and behind his head to the position from which the hip/leg can PULL. It is BESIDE him....and therefore when he goes, his hip/leg assembly is not PULLING....and because of that he has to move his hands forward by way of a push with the arms and he ends up with both the arms and the hip PUSHING his barrel to contact.

This clip here REALLY shows the difference downstream....



Tex's rear hip and leg are still PULLING the barrel around as he turns the barrel around his hand pivot point.

Cheyenne is pushing like a mother, in and through contact, with his arms and his hip to get his barrel up to speed.....all because of a poor stance/setup and a poor understanding of what it must feel like in the rear hip socket.

Your second question is 'what should it 'feel' like? And this is your best question because only when you look for 'feel' will you find the 'look'.

You've already felt the SnF feeling if I read you correctly at bbd. Another good way to learn the feel is to do this....



....and to understand that that feels a lot like this....



....with the hip/leg assembly driving.....your transimission is engaged not in neutral....your hip/leg aren't just moving without a direct connection to the torso and thereby moving it also. They are driving the torso....they are driving the turn IN THE REAR HIP SOCKET....which turns the entire torso when the proper pull backs are in place. Meaning...the lower back, the scap as well as the hip....must be pullilng rearward constantly and continuously....for the LEG to drive. The hip NEVER fires....the leg drives the 'fused' torso....which has a direct connection to the barrel because of the pull backs. In essence, your hands are connected to your leg and as your leg turns the fused torso, you also turn the hands rearward to drive the barrel rearward. This adds resistance to the leg and makes it fire even harder. The bat is YANKED forward at warp speed.....by way of whip....without the push of the arm action and rear hip.

P.S. The one-legged drill shown above must be started AND FINISHED with one leg. If you fall forward to your lead leg you've missed the point....you've missed the feel. To do that you have to maintain a 'centered' balance over the rear hip/leg....and you must launch the barrel rearward by way of whip. If you push your hands forward your weight will shift and you'll end up on your front leg. Start and finish the swing while never allowing weight to shift so that you have to catch yourself with your lead leg.

[Allistair]

The Truth is a difficult thing to explain. It's difficult to 'see' until you 'feel' it.

This is the truth. This is the "aha" moment.
It took me many months reading here and I didnt understand it until I felt it. Then every word made sense.

But you got to go "all in". You cant mix other methods in and still "feel" what Teach is teaching. ONLY until you feel it, can you attempt to add on.

Others never felt it. Yet they tweeked the drills to accomodate their lack of "feel". Then they said, "I have a better way or "its just as good as".

Nope, they never did understood because they never "felt" it.

If you can "feel" what Teach, Pronk and others are trying to teach, then you will understand. It is effortless, sudden and powerful.

[LITHTHUNDER]

Oh boy people.. I think I've ahead my A-ha moment!! With the combination of the Nadal clip and Molitor Clip I think I'm finally getting it.. I first made sure I had the coil and pull back in my stance and just let it go, I did get the inward movement of the knee as Molitor does.. Then I tried to get into a tennis move to hit as Nadal did, setting the coil really pulling back w/the back/scap and as soon as I lifted my foot I pulled harder, let it go and felt the upward uncoiling/pull!!

I'm having a hard time doing in a lefty stance right now - I think because I can't get a solid enough coil right now (because I was trying so hard the "wrong" way, my hip/hamstring are a little sore). I can really feel an explosion w/this new swing!! I hope this is right and I can keep working on it.. My righty swing isn't the best, I don't have as good of control w/my hands..

I'll get video up tonight hopefully to see what you guys think..

Thanks!!
Thunder

[Teacherman]

The feeling these two hitters have in the rear hip socket is IDENTICAL.



The 'look' changes because Cabrera is not confined to one leg.

Doing the one-legged drill will teach you the 'feel' in the rear hip socket.

Once you know what 'feel' you are looking for, you can learn to create that feel while doing the other things a swing requires, while not letting those 'other things' remove that feel.

Get that feel.
Learn that feel.
Memorize that feel.
Create that feel on demand.
Keep that feel while you put the swing together.
Don't let any other element of the swing remove that feel.
If it does....abandon that which removes the feel....start over.

HINT: You're looking for a one-legged feel stance....with two legs on the ground. Get in the stance with one-leg....then lower the lead leg to a point that does not give up that one-legged feeling.

[Teacherman]

Video coming?

[LITHTHUNDER]

Sorry Teach, my boys have had basketball games the last two nights..

Thanks for the those reminders and cues on the feel!! Ok, I've been trying the one-legged drill both righty and lefty.. left hammy still a little tender.

Before I continue on, can you take a look and comment on my one-legged drill. Looking at the video of the kid, it seems he is opening up better than I am. I also notice a wobble in my knee.

I am very confident I am setting the coil now, I've got that part down.. Right now I'm trying to find the best way to pull back.. If I counter rotate, pulling back w/my hands and my elbow but I obviously don't wont the shoulders to turn too far away from the pitcher.. I'm trying to look more like Cabrera which I believe from what I read is using his hands/forearms to "tip" his triangle..

Thanks,
Thunder

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PTxGlr67Z3Y

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v1QjxAZ_EQ8

[Teacherman]

The lefty is far better than the righty.

In this drill....you do the best you can regarding the counter-rotation of your shoulders. Yes, you need to see the ball. But this is simply a drill to learn a 'feeling'....a 'feeling' in your rear hip.

I know what you felt in the lefty swing is correct....whether or not you could see the ball or opened up enough or if your swing plane was too steep....blah blah blah.

The challenge now is to create that feeling all the time.....while using a normal stance....and getting a not so steep swing plane....and being able to see the pitcher.

As to seeing the pitcher....you simply pigeon-toe your rear foot as much as you need to so you can get the same loaded feeling in the rear leg/hip... AND....keep two eyes on the pitcher.

Now....set up just as you did when using one leg....with the same weight distribution....same stance....same handset....initially....hold it....feel it....learn it....memorize it....then lower your lead leg....and bring it forward into a normal stance....WITHOUT GIVING UP THE FEELING IN THE REAR HIP/LEG. In other words.....create the one-legged feeling while using two legs. You don't do much at all with the lead leg....but you do position it so that you have better balance and can execute a real swing in a game.

Play the lefty swing frame by frame. You can not see the barrel come around. THAT is proof that what you did was correct. The turn of the leg/hip assembly with your hand pivot point is the only way to create that. Your leg is the driver....it is driving against the rearward turn of the barrel. You should have felt that relationship....between the second engine turning the barrel rearward AS the leg turns the leg/hip assembly forward.

Your gears are working correctly in the lefty swing...

[Teacherman]

This.....



....lies hidden under and powers every high level hitter....and it is disquised by the other leg.....that the hitter has.....that this guy doesn't have.

[Teacherman]

In the righty clip....you do the same thing redwill's son does....you do the same thing danhapp's son does....you do the same thing Powertoallfield's son does....you do the same thing 1Chapter's son does....you do the same thing ALL of Swingbuilder's students do.....you do 'the amateur'.....you move the hands in front THEN you turn....and you end up pushing instead of pulling....YOUR ARMS ARE DRIVING THAT SWING.

Tell me you could feel the difference.....please.

Or not.

[Teacherman]

A swing with your chest....



A swing with your back....

[LITHTHUNDER]

Teach, that's awesome!! I'm glad it looks good lefty.. I really only play golf right handed and some softball, because I had more power - had being the key word, as I'm hoping this new found swing can give me more power lefty!! I just think my hand control is not as good for a baseball swing on the right side.. It definitely felt better from the left side!

Question.. Is it ok to pre-set the coil in the box and then coil more into it/against it?

Thanks for the tip on pigeon toeing in.. I'll try that next time. Below is a clip of a full swing lefty before I saw that advice.. I can already tell I am moving out more balanced, no shit in the woods - right? I can see my hips really exploding upward.. should my hips be open more before contact?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NJYmTYT9v6M

I have to say, I'm very glad and excited for you to have reached out to me so that I can get a grasp on this.. Funny thing is, I've never been told any of this all my years of baseball.. I only played as high as Communtiy College, but not once did I ever hear of this? Do pros learn this or they just naturally come about it?

Also, I see this works for pitching as well.. Do you have some good links I can refer to on how it works from a pitching aspect?

Thanks
Thunder